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Outsiders Thoughts About OA - Winterlight - 06-26-2017
I've tried, over the years to flack OA in various gaming chat rooms. Most recently in Star Citizen.
People either /love/ OA or tell me in private chat, "You go there? Its fucking tired"
At first that sort of thing offended me. OA is God's Own Goodness, how could you /possibly/ not love it
if your playing a SF game that involves ships and space?
Apparently its too well defined. "I could never rp there" said one, though I mentioned its not an RP area, just ideas.
Mostly that was the problem with many, OA was built and set in concrete and no fun.
@.@
I know, its not like that and the whole thing is still able to have more to it. Just pointing out what the kids seem to
think.
Well from my perspective its not like that. I think its fun so there.
*appeal to nyah!* XD
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uQ0g5UF45fo
RE: Outsiders Thoughts About OA - Drashner1 - 06-26-2017
Some people like OA, some people don't - different strokes for different folks, basically
As far as RPing here (and bearing in mind I am not a gamer) - As I understand it OA is moderately popular as a source for RP ideas, although I don't know if anyone has ever tried playing a game set in the universe itself rather than just using it as a source of individual ideas.
Also, it's not clear to me what 'too well defined' means. The rules of the setting are the laws of physics and that places limits on what you can do - but that also leaves a huge amount of room to play. One aspect of this might be that there is so much content making up the setting that it could seem overwhelming to try to master it all just to play a game. But I would argue that it's really not necessary to learn every aspect of the setting to play in it - although it might be necessary to learn the parts that pertain to whatever place you're playing in.
One issue we've seen raised in the concept of gaming is that OA doesn't really lend itself to powermodding and it definitely doesn't lend itself to either 'plucky baselines' or playing a transapient character. At least not realistically, as the setting defines it.
Finally, there is the issue that the structure of the setting doesn't really lend itself to zipping from one end of the galaxy to the other (or even one end of a solar system to the other) in an instant. If you're going to play in a way that is true to the setting, you either need to figure out how to sidestep that issue (perhaps by having your players go into stasis for such periods or just jumping around via GM fiat - 'you leave for location X and arrive 5 days later' kind of thing perhaps.
Or something like that - I honestly don't see this sort of thing as a true problem - but perhaps I'm missing something.
As far as OA being set in concrete - Do other settings allow their rules to be bent or broken at will for the convenience of players? I don't think so, but I'm not sure.
Or do they mean something else when speaking in terms of OA being built and set in concrete already? Perhaps they feel there isn't anything else to create here and that's what they are looking to do? I think the ongoing nature of the project shows that isn't true.
Did any of these people provide any further clarification into what it was about the setting they were struggling with?
Not that we're going to redo the whole thing just because some people dislike it - but it's interesting to gather this kind of information and it may lead to ideas to make the setting more widely appealing while also being true to its core principles. Or just explaining it better than we've been doing up to this point.
Thoughts?
Todd
RE: Outsiders Thoughts About OA - Avengium - 06-26-2017
I think this is an interesting question. Because i know people too who don't like OA.
RE: Outsiders Thoughts About OA - Rynn - 06-26-2017
No franchise, group, media, hobby or anything else can be popular with everyone. Critical feedback is useful, people just not finding it to their tastes or needs is just a fact of life.
RE: Outsiders Thoughts About OA - stevebowers - 06-27-2017
This is an interesting comment;
"I could never rp there"
Of course the earliest parts of OA were originally set up as a roleplaying scenario; Big Ideas, Grand Vision by Anders Sandberg. That was more open-ended because it only really went up to the start of OA's First Federation.
If anyone was serious about open-ended roleplaying in OA, they should set up a scenario at the edge of the Outer Volumes, preferably interacting with unpredictable aliens or some bizarre blight. The fact that the Archailects are around to save the day is problematic for open-ended play. But bear in mind that just about every xenosophont empire that has ever existed in the Milky Way galaxy has vanished for one reason or another, and not even the Terragens are certain to persist.
RE: Outsiders Thoughts About OA - Avengium - 06-27-2017
Maybe people has a bias about OA and think is very restricted and has no room for imagination.
For example: One can think archailects know everything. And the things that happens are only because the archailects allow it to happen. So, the characters don't have freedom to make the RolePlay.
Or maybe someone want to play with some of the tropes about space that are used in other settings.
A lot of this can be due to a lack of information about the project.
I don't think the "illustrated backstory" http://www.orionsarm.com/xcms.php?r=oa-backstory show a picture near to the project reality.
Illustrated backstory has 10 panels and 8 are for the first millenium. In the other 2 panels are FirstFed, SecFed, Version War, etc.
Edit: Also, what you are saying Steve too. Some places of OA still look like the year 2001. (Or apparently look like that) because Big Ideas Grand Vision goes up to the start of OA's First Federation. (Like the mentioned illustrated Backstory).
RE: Outsiders Thoughts About OA - Drashner1 - 06-27-2017
(06-27-2017, 02:06 AM)stevebowers Wrote: This is an interesting comment;
"I could never rp there"
Of course the earliest parts of OA were originally set up as a roleplaying scenario; Big Ideas, Grand Vision by Anders Sandberg. That was more open-ended because it only really went up to the start of OA's First Federation.
If anyone was serious about open-ended roleplaying in OA, they should set up a scenario at the edge of the Outer Volumes, preferably interacting with unpredictable aliens or some bizarre blight. The fact that the Archailects are around to save the day is problematic for open-ended play. But bear in mind that just about every xenosophont empire that has ever existed in the Milky Way galaxy has vanished for one reason or another, and not even the Terragens are certain to persist.
The thing is is that the Archai aren't around to save the day in huge swaths of the setting. It seems to me that you could fit a lot of open-ended role play into a portion of the setting where the nearest archailect will take decades to ever show up, assuming it even bothers to do so.
I somewhat wonder if part of the issue (maybe a big part) is that people want all the cool tech toys that the transapients and archai either provide or have for themselves - but don't want any of the things that come with that in the setting - like the presence of transapients and archai that make humans seem like impotent bugs in comparison.
In this scenario, it's not literally the case that they can't RP in the setting - but that they can't do whatever they please with no limits or consequences. Although, I find it hard to believe that other RP universes don't have limits or consequences of their own.
Todd
RE: Outsiders Thoughts About OA - Drashner1 - 06-27-2017
(06-27-2017, 02:13 AM)Avengium Wrote: Maybe people has a bias about OA and think is very restricted and has no room for imagination.
For example: One can think archailects know everything. And the things that happens are only because the archailects allow it to happen. So, the characters don't have freedom to make the RolePlay.
There are presumably RP settings with gods who (at least in principle) know and control everything. And in OA, this is a simple issue to avoid - just go to places where the archai and transapients aren't.
(06-27-2017, 02:13 AM)Avengium Wrote: Or maybe someone want to play with some of the tropes about space that are used in other settings.
Such as? I'm guessing FTL travel and/or ships dogfighting in space, but that's just a guess. And again, I would think a lot of other RP settings have various rules and limits on how their spacecraft operate. Beyond that, how much of any given RP game is spent doing stuff in space?
Coming at this from a different direction - One thought that comes to mind is that OA makes little allowance for people 'getting away with stuff' - things like hacking computer systems, breaking into vaults, outwitting security systems or personnel, or personally fighting off a superior force. We tend to depict most tech and processes in the setting as close to perfect at what they do and nearly unbeatable - at least at the level that human level characters would play at. My (possibly incorrect) sense of RPGs is that characters do a lot of this kind of thing and not being able to do it - or it being very hard to figure out how to do it - might be seen as a large negative to people interested in RPing within the setting.
As with the issue of archai and transaps, I think there are ways to address that - but it might be a matter of leading people to seeing what those options and opportunities are.
(06-27-2017, 02:13 AM)Avengium Wrote: A lot of this can be due to a lack of information about the project.
I don't think the "illustrated backstory" http://www.orionsarm.com/xcms.php?r=oa-backstory show a picture near to the project reality.
Illustrated backstory has 10 panels and 8 are for the first millenium. In the other 2 panels are FirstFed, SecFed, Version War, etc.
Edit: Also, what you are saying Steve too. Some places of OA still look like the year 2001. (Or apparently look like that) because Big Ideas Grand Vision goes up to the start of OA's First Federation. (Like the mentioned illustrated Backstory).
I'm also not a fan of the illustrated backstory and would like to replace it in some fashion - although I'm not sure with what at this point.
Todd
RE: Outsiders Thoughts About OA - Avengium - 06-27-2017
(06-27-2017, 03:29 AM)Drashner1 Wrote: I'm also not a fan of the illustrated backstory and would like to replace it in some fashion - although I'm not sure with what at this point.
Todd
Maybe remaking the Illustrated Backstory. Choosing different text. Or maybe adding more panels. But only editors can do that.
RE: Outsiders Thoughts About OA - Rynn - 06-27-2017
(06-27-2017, 03:29 AM)Drashner1 Wrote: Coming at this from a different direction - One thought that comes to mind is that OA makes little allowance for people 'getting away with stuff' - things like hacking computer systems, breaking into vaults, outwitting security systems or personnel, or personally fighting off a superior force. We tend to depict most tech and processes in the setting as close to perfect at what they do and nearly unbeatable - at least at the level that human level characters would play at. My (possibly incorrect) sense of RPGs is that characters do a lot of this kind of thing and not being able to do it - or it being very hard to figure out how to do it - might be seen as a large negative to people interested in RPing within the setting.
I think this is key. And if because of this OA is difficult-impossible to make an RPG about then "oh well". It's a worldbuilding group, there's plenty of things that it wouldn't be good at or appropriate for.